Plagiarism: You Know It When You See It (Really?)
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Derek Catsam - 3/24/2002
IF you use my words and do not directly cite me, with quotation marks and full citation, it is plagiarism. And if you quote me dozens or even hundreds of times to write your article or book, even with proper citation, it is pretty shoddy. Let's not excuse these actions. We can forgive. No one says that Ambrose and Goodwin cannot redeem themselves, but they have done what they have done. No amount of apologia will change that.
Michael Ingrisano - 3/21/2002
History’s Retelling
St. Onge uses some rather odd language in defense of Ambrose and Goodwin. "At age 81, I felt familiar enough with World War II …to go directly to the plagiarism issue…But we must note that both authors are writing where multitudes have scrolled at prodigious length. To expect pristine originality in history’s retelling is to expect the impossible."
At age 81, I am also familiar with WWII having served for three years. But that does not excuse me from not expecting "pristine originality" in writing, not retelling, that history. On that score, Ambrose fails miserably, and we have the "multitudes that have scrolled at prodigious length" demanding that Ambrose tell that truth.
Philip Nobile - 3/19/2002
Prof. St. Onge's interesting whitewash of Ambrose and Goodwin misses an important point: both have already confessed to the crime he says they did not commit. Further, in Goodwin's case, it was difficult for readers to distinguish between marginal and subtantial copying in No Ordinary Time because she threatened to sue the author (me) who tried to open the discussion here on HNN and then HNN killed the discussion, which had been edited, released and was minutes from posting as unfair to Goodwin. So much for freedom of historical argument.
Philip Nobile
Pierre Troublion - 3/18/2002
Professor St. Onge proposes a new definition of plagiarism: the improperly attributed copying of "original complex sentences". This is much narrower than the definition of Webster: "to pass off the ideas or words of another as one's own or to present as new and original an idea or product derived from an existing source." Leaving aside the question of whether St. Onge or Webster is the better authority on the English language, the latter definition is quite obviously the fairer. It is a popular trend nowadays for lawyers to argue about the meaning of words, rather than to use the law to help solve problems, but there are better responses than to redefine English along legal lines.
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